[LON-CAPA-users] Open date versus Contentopen?

Todd Ruskell lon-capa-users@mail.lon-capa.org
Mon, 02 Jun 2008 21:24:48 -0600


Using pages does have some interesting effects.  I think they're
starting to get used more often now, but for a while it seemed many
things were not well optimized for pages, but I believe many of them
have gotten ironed out.

But directly to your issue:  I ran into this a lot last summer when
trying to work with "Pages".  I think everything below is still the
case, but I'm sure someone like Gerd or Stuart will correct me if I'm
wrong.  From a LON-CAPA system standpoint, a "Page" is not any different
than a "folder" or a "sequence" except that everything appears on one
concatenated html page.  Also, for better or for worse, LON-CAPA has
very limited cascading of parameters down through sub-folders.  What
does this mean?  Assume the following course structure:

Folder 1
  Page 1.1
    Problem 1.1.1
    Problem 1.1.2
  Page 1.2
    Problem 1.2.1
    Problem 1.2.2
  Problem 1.1
  Problem 1.2

If you set parameters like open/close/due dates on the enclosing folder
of "Folder 1", say by viewing the parameters of "Problem 1.1" or with
the "Overview" mode, the only resources affected will be "Problem 1.1"
and "Problem 1.2".  The parameters will *not* cascade further down the tree.

If you view, for example "Problem 1.1.1", and use PPRM to set
open/close/due dates for the enclosing folder, the enclosing folder is
actually "Page 1.1", *not* "Folder 1".  I for one would very much like
to see the automatic cascading of parameters down through all
sub-folders/pages, but this is apparently a bit challenging.  First, it
could make for an even uglier PPRM page, but I suspect it has something
to do with not knowing for sure just how many levels may be present in
any part of the tree.  At any rate, it just doesn't happen.  You should,
however, be able to use the overview mode to set the parameters for each
"Page" in a slightly more efficient manner.

<editorial comment>
The current behavior of parameter cascading has the undesired side
effect of making Pages a much less useful tool.  Although arguably quite
nice from a presentation standpoint, the management standpoint leaves a
lot to be desired.  As a result, we ended up not using pages nearly as
much as I'd like, but instead resorted to multi-part problems.
</editorial comment>

One last item.  When looking at a "Page" you've got to be very careful
which resource you are setting the parameters of.  It sounds like you're
using the remote control.  In this case, when you view a "Page", the
PPRM button brings up the parameters for the "Page" as a whole, not a
particular resource within the "Page".  That is why you get "Content
Opening Date" rather than "Problem Opening Date".  If you do not use the
Remote Control, you get the same effect by clicking on the "Set
Parameters" icon at the very top of the page.  If you want to look at
the parameters for a particular resource within the page, you need to
use the "Set Parameter" links that appear scattered throughout the
"Page".  They're actually not scattered, but appear at the top of each
resource.  If you use the embedded link, you can get the parameters for
one of your embedded problems, including Open/Due Dates.

Hope that helps,


Robert_Brewington@er.monroe.edu wrote:
> Yes, I do have a couple of "dummy" students so I can make sure what they
> see.
> I have set both the Open Date and Content Open date for the future: June
> 6, 2008 - today is Jun 2. Due date is set for Jun 18 or so. When I log
> in as the student, it shows the problems as open, the student can look
> at the problem and answer it. The due date looks correct.
> Interesting idea, that contentopen applies to non-problem things (like
> pdf files). However, I see this parameter on my problem, not a different
> file type. So, I still don't know what ContentOpen means.
> Maybe my use of pages (rather than sequences) does something odd? I have
> a folder containing a bunch of "pages" rather than sequences (the icon
> is a puzzle piece). Each page contains two problems (question mark
> icons). I view the problem, and select PPRM (set parameters for this
> resource) which shows the colored grid of parameters and their settings.
> Folder:  Final Review
>    Page: Final Page 1
>       Problem:  FinalProblem
>       Problem:  DummyProblem
>   Page: Final Page 2
>       Problem:  FinalProblem    <--- Setting PPRM at this point
>       Problem:  DummyProblem
> Using Parameter Helper Mode, I set Due date to 6/18 and Open date to 6/6
> at the Final Review folder level. I set some earlier page individual Due
> Dates using Parameter Overview mode (on Final Page 2, for example).
> Lastly, as part of playing around I set Content Due Date at the Final
> Review folder level using the PPRM screen.
> Looking at the PPRM screen for a FinalProblem, I see Content Open date
> and Content Due date. The Content Due Date Current Session Value is
> blank; it does not show the effect of the Due date which I set at the
> Final Review folder level, and the Content Open date shows the value I
> set at the Enclosing Map Folder level ("Final Review").
> In the PPRM screen there is no other indication of Open Date or Due
> Date. So, it appears that I can only set Open/Due dates from the
> Menu/Parameter Settings tools, not from PPRM. On the other hand, the
> Open date does not seem to be taking effect for some reason.
> And as I indicated, the student sees no indication of an open date, and
> can open and answer the problem today. I guess I don't really care about
> the ContentOpen and Due date (other than wondering what the heck they
> are); what I really need is to know why the Open date isn't having an
> effect.
> Thanks,
> brew
> lon-capa-users-admin@mail.lon-capa.org wrote: -----
>     To: lon-capa-users@mail.lon-capa.org
>     From: "Justin Gray" <jgray@math.sfu.ca>
>     Sent by: lon-capa-users-admin@mail.lon-capa.org
>     Date: 06/02/2008 03:46PM
>     Subject: Re: [LON-CAPA-users] Open date versus Contentopen?
>     Hi Brew,
>     I believe you can set the individual due dates from a single screen
>     at Parameter Manager -> Overview Mode
>     (Select Parameter Level at Resource Level and select the enclosing
>     folder that you want. Then select only Problem Due Date from the
>     table of parameters.)
>     If students can see the due dates, I believe the problems should be
>     open. If your folder contains only problems, what you want to set is
>     Problem Opening Date. Content Opening Date does not seem to apply to
>     problems.
>     It is a good idea to assign yourself a dummy student role in your
>     course, so that you can see what your students see. It is better to
>     do this using a different account since you will sometimes have
>     additional privileges that other students do not when you are logged
>     in as yourself. You can do this as follows:
>     1) Go to Manage Course Users -> Enroll a single student
>     2) Add a dummy username
>     3) Select Internally authenticated and add a dummy password
>     Note that any parameters set at the section level will not apply to
>     this dummy student if no section is assigned.
>     Justin
>     On Mon, Jun 2, 2008 at 11:21 AM, <Robert_Brewington@er.monroe.edu
>     <mailto:Robert_Brewington@er.monroe.edu>> wrote:
>         I am trying to set some dates on a series of problems, and have
>         a couple of questions.
>         1) I have 50 questions in a folder. I set the due date for the
>         entire folder to Jun13. Now, I want to set the due dates for
>         problems 1-5 to be Jun10, 6-12 to Jun11, 13-25 to Jun 12.
>         Is there a way to set these through a single screen? I am
>         setting each problem individually, which is a lot of slow
>         screens. Just a convenience issue...
>         2) I am not seeing the Opendate. I set the Open date for a
>         folder, then a bunch of due dates for the problems. The student
>         sees the due dates, but the Open date doesn't seem to apply (for
>         my Chemistry course). What else do I set to make the open date work?
>         I also tried setting something called contentopen from the pprm
>         screen, for the enclosing folder. What is this supposed to be?
>         It also does not seem to affect the student's view of the
>         problem opening.
>         I note that the opendate does not appear in the PPRM parameter
>         screen? I guess I'm just note sure what I am seeing...
>         Thanks,
>         brew
>         _______________________________________________ LON-CAPA-users
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>     -- 
>     ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>     Justin Gray
>     Dept. of Mathematics
>     Simon Fraser University
>     8888 University Drive
>     Burnaby, B.C. V5A 1S6
>     Canada
>     Tel. +1 778-782-4237
>     Fax. +1 778-782-4947
>     ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 
> _______________________________________________ LON-CAPA-users mailing
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Dr. Todd Ruskell
Senior Lecturer, Department of Physics       Office:  Meyer Hall 326
Colorado School of Mines                     Phone: 303-384-2080
1523 Illinois Street                         Fax: 303-273-3919
Golden, CO 80401