[LON-CAPA-users] Open date versus Contentopen?

lon-capa-users@mail.lon-capa.org lon-capa-users@mail.lon-capa.org
Tue, 3 Jun 2008 11:54:19 -0400

<div>I tried what you say - sure enough, if I look at the PPRM for the prob=
lem within the page ("icons "scattered" throughout), I get the desired Open=
 date and it seems to work. How bizarre that parameters do not propagate th=
rough the tree.<br><br>Since they don't propagate, wow! an awful lot of wor=
k to set open dates on a couple of hundred problems. I timed setting a few;=
 in the end, I don't think I have the 6 hours it looks like it will take to=
 set them all. <br><br>brew<br></div><font color=3D"#990099">-----lon-capa-=
users-admin@mail.lon-capa.org wrote: -----<br><br></font><blockquote style=
=3D"border-left: 2px solid rgb(0, 0, 0); padding-right: 0px; padding-left: =
5px; margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px;">To: lon-capa-users@mail.lon-capa=
.org<br>From: Todd Ruskell &lt;truskell@mines.edu&gt;<br>Sent by: lon-capa-=
users-admin@mail.lon-capa.org<br>Date: 06/02/2008 11:24PM<br>Subject: Re: [=
LON-CAPA-users] Open date versus Contentopen?<br><br><font face=3D"Courier =
New,Courier,monospace" size=3D"3">Brew,<br><br>Using pages does have some i=
nteresting effects. &nbsp;I think they're<br>starting to get used more ofte=
n now, but for a while it seemed many<br>things were not well optimized for=
 pages, but I believe many of them<br>have gotten ironed out.<br><br>But di=
rectly to your issue: &nbsp;I ran into this a lot last summer when<br>tryin=
g to work with "Pages". &nbsp;I think everything below is still the<br>case=
, but I'm sure someone like Gerd or Stuart will correct me if I'm<br>wrong.=
 &nbsp;From a LON-CAPA system standpoint, a "Page" is not any different<br>=
than a "folder" or a "sequence" except that everything appears on one<br>co=
ncatenated html page. &nbsp;Also, for better or for worse, LON-CAPA has<br>=
very limited cascading of parameters down through sub-folders. &nbsp;What<b=
r>does this mean? &nbsp;Assume the following course structure:<br><br>Folde=
r 1<br> &nbsp;Page 1.1<br> &nbsp; &nbsp;Problem 1.1.1<br> &nbsp; &nbsp;Prob=
lem 1.1.2<br> &nbsp;Page 1.2<br> &nbsp; &nbsp;Problem 1.2.1<br> &nbsp; &nbs=
p;Problem 1.2.2<br> &nbsp;Problem 1.1<br> &nbsp;Problem 1.2<br><br>If you s=
et parameters like open/close/due dates on the enclosing folder<br>of "Fold=
er 1", say by viewing the parameters of "Problem 1.1" or with<br>the "Overv=
iew" mode, the only resources affected will be "Problem 1.1"<br>and "Proble=
m 1.2". &nbsp;The parameters will *not* cascade further down the tree.<br><=
br>If you view, for example "Problem 1.1.1", and use PPRM to set<br>open/cl=
ose/due dates for the enclosing folder, the enclosing folder is<br>actually=
 "Page 1.1", *not* "Folder 1". &nbsp;I for one would very much like<br>to s=
ee the automatic cascading of parameters down through all<br>sub-folders/pa=
ges, but this is apparently a bit challenging. &nbsp;First, it<br>could mak=
e for an even uglier PPRM page, but I suspect it has something<br>to do wit=
h not knowing for sure just how many levels may be present in<br>any part o=
f the tree. &nbsp;At any rate, it just doesn't happen. &nbsp;You should,<br=
>however, be able to use the overview mode to set the parameters for each<b=
r>"Page" in a slightly more efficient manner.<br><br>&lt;editorial comment&=
gt;<br>The current behavior of parameter cascading has the undesired side<b=
r>effect of making Pages a much less useful tool. &nbsp;Although arguably q=
uite<br>nice from a presentation standpoint, the management standpoint leav=
es a<br>lot to be desired. &nbsp;As a result, we ended up not using pages n=
early as<br>much as I'd like, but instead resorted to multi-part problems.<=
br>&lt;/editorial comment&gt;<br><br>One last item. &nbsp;When looking at a=
 "Page" you've got to be very careful<br>which resource you are setting the=
 parameters of. &nbsp;It sounds like you're<br>using the remote control. &n=
bsp;In this case, when you view a "Page", the<br>PPRM button brings up the =
parameters for the "Page" as a whole, not a<br>particular resource within t=
he "Page". &nbsp;That is why you get "Content<br>Opening Date" rather than =
"Problem Opening Date". &nbsp;If you do not use the<br>Remote Control, you =
get the same effect by clicking on the "Set<br>Parameters" icon at the very=
 top of the page. &nbsp;If you want to look at<br>the parameters for a part=
icular resource within the page, you need to<br>use the "Set Parameter" lin=
ks that appear scattered throughout the<br>"Page". &nbsp;They're actually n=
ot scattered, but appear at the top of each<br>resource. &nbsp;If you use t=
he embedded link, you can get the parameters for<br>one of your embedded pr=
oblems, including Open/Due Dates.<br><br>Hope that helps,<br><br>Todd<br><b=
r>Robert=5FBrewington@er.monroe.edu wrote:<br>&gt; Yes, I do have a couple =
of "dummy" students so I can make sure what they<br>&gt; see.<br>&gt; <br>&=
gt; I have set both the Open Date and Content Open date for the future: Jun=
e<br>&gt; 6, 2008 - today is Jun 2. Due date is set for Jun 18 or so. When =
I log<br>&gt; in as the student, it shows the problems as open, the student=
 can look<br>&gt; at the problem and answer it. The due date looks correct.=
<br>&gt; <br>&gt; Interesting idea, that contentopen applies to non-problem=
 things (like<br>&gt; pdf files). However, I see this parameter on my probl=
em, not a different<br>&gt; file type. So, I still don't know what ContentO=
pen means.<br>&gt; <br>&gt; Maybe my use of pages (rather than sequences) d=
oes something odd? I have<br>&gt; a folder containing a bunch of "pages" ra=
ther than sequences (the icon<br>&gt; is a puzzle piece). Each page contain=
s two problems (question mark<br>&gt; icons). I view the problem, and selec=
t PPRM (set parameters for this<br>&gt; resource) which shows the colored g=
rid of parameters and their settings.<br>&gt; Folder: &nbsp;Final Review<br=
>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp;Page: Final Page 1<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Problem:=
 &nbsp;FinalProblem<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Problem: &nbsp;DummyProble=
m<br>&gt; <br>&gt; &nbsp; Page: Final Page 2<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; P=
roblem: &nbsp;FinalProblem &nbsp; &nbsp;&lt;--- Setting PPRM at this point<=
br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Problem: &nbsp;DummyProblem<br>&gt; <br>&gt; U=
sing Parameter Helper Mode, I set Due date to 6/18 and Open date to 6/6<br>=
&gt; at the Final Review folder level. I set some earlier page individual D=
ue<br>&gt; Dates using Parameter Overview mode (on Final Page 2, for exampl=
e).<br>&gt; Lastly, as part of playing around I set Content Due Date at the=
 Final<br>&gt; Review folder level using the PPRM screen.<br>&gt; <br>&gt; =
Looking at the PPRM screen for a FinalProblem, I see Content Open date<br>&=
gt; and Content Due date. The Content Due Date Current Session Value is<br>=
&gt; blank; it does not show the effect of the Due date which I set at the<=
br>&gt; Final Review folder level, and the Content Open date shows the valu=
e I<br>&gt; set at the Enclosing Map Folder level ("Final Review").<br>&gt;=
 <br>&gt; In the PPRM screen there is no other indication of Open Date or D=
ue<br>&gt; Date. So, it appears that I can only set Open/Due dates from the=
<br>&gt; Menu/Parameter Settings tools, not from PPRM. On the other hand, t=
he<br>&gt; Open date does not seem to be taking effect for some reason.<br>=
&gt; <br>&gt; And as I indicated, the student sees no indication of an open=
 date, and<br>&gt; can open and answer the problem today. I guess I don't r=
eally care about<br>&gt; the ContentOpen and Due date (other than wondering=
 what the heck they<br>&gt; are); what I really need is to know why the Ope=
n date isn't having an<br>&gt; effect.<br>&gt; <br>&gt; Thanks,<br>&gt; bre=
w<br>&gt; lon-capa-users-admin@mail.lon-capa.org wrote: -----<br>&gt; <br>&=
gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; To: lon-capa-users@mail.lon-capa.org<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp=
; From: "Justin Gray" &lt;jgray@math.sfu.ca&gt;<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Sent =
by: lon-capa-users-admin@mail.lon-capa.org<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Date: 06/0=
2/2008 03:46PM<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Subject: Re: [LON-CAPA-users] Open dat=
e versus Contentopen?<br>&gt; <br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Hi Brew,<br>&gt; <br>&=
gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; I believe you can set the individual due dates from a sin=
gle screen<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; at Parameter Manager -&gt; Overview Mode<b=
r>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; (Select Parameter Level at Resource Level and select t=
he enclosing<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; folder that you want. Then select only P=
roblem Due Date from the<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; table of parameters.)<br>&gt=
; <br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; If students can see the due dates, I believe the p=
roblems should be<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; open. If your folder contains only =
problems, what you want to set is<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Problem Opening Dat=
e. Content Opening Date does not seem to apply to<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; pro=
blems.<br>&gt; <br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; It is a good idea to assign yourself =
a dummy student role in your<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; course, so that you can =
see what your students see. It is better to<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; do this u=
sing a different account since you will sometimes have<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp=
; additional privileges that other students do not when you are logged<br>&=
gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; in as yourself. You can do this as follows:<br>&gt; <br>&=
gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1) Go to Manage Course Users -&gt; Enroll a single studen=
t<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2) Add a dummy username<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; 3) Se=
lect Internally authenticated and add a dummy password<br>&gt; <br>&gt; &nb=
sp; &nbsp; Note that any parameters set at the section level will not apply=
 to<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; this dummy student if no section is assigned.<br>=
&gt; <br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Justin<br>&gt; <br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; On Mon, J=
un 2, 2008 at 11:21 AM, &lt;Robert=5FBrewington@er.monroe.edu<br>&gt; &nbsp=
; &nbsp; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:Robert=5FBrewington@er.monroe.edu">mailto:Ro=
bert=5FBrewington@er.monroe.edu</a>&gt;&gt; wrote:<br>&gt; <br>&gt; &nbsp; =
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I am trying to set some dates on a series of problems,=
 and have<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; a couple of questions.<br>&gt=
; <br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1) I have 50 questions in a folder. =
I set the due date for the<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; entire folde=
r to Jun13. Now, I want to set the due dates for<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbs=
p; &nbsp; problems 1-5 to be Jun10, 6-12 to Jun11, 13-25 to Jun 12.<br>&gt;=
 <br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Is there a way to set these through a=
 single screen? I am<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; setting each probl=
em individually, which is a lot of slow<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;=
 screens. Just a convenience issue...<br>&gt; <br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;=
 &nbsp; 2) I am not seeing the Opendate. I set the Open date for a<br>&gt; =
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; folder, then a bunch of due dates for the probl=
ems. The student<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; sees the due dates, bu=
t the Open date doesn't seem to apply (for<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nb=
sp; my Chemistry course). What else do I set to make the open date work?<br=
>&gt; <br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I also tried setting something c=
alled contentopen from the pprm<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; screen,=
 for the enclosing folder. What is this supposed to be?<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbs=
p; &nbsp; &nbsp; It also does not seem to affect the student's view of the<=
br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; problem opening.<br>&gt; <br>&gt; &nbsp=
; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I note that the opendate does not appear in the PPRM=
 parameter<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; screen? I guess I'm just not=
e sure what I am seeing...<br>&gt; <br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Tha=
nks,<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; brew<br>&gt; <br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp=
; &nbsp; &nbsp; =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=
=5F=5F=5F LON-CAPA-users<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; mailing list L=
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<br>&gt; <br>&gt; <br>&gt; <br>&gt; <br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; -- <br>&gt; &nbs=
p; &nbsp; ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<br>&=
gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Justin Gray<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Dept. of Mathematics<br=
>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Simon Fraser University<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; 8888 Univ=
ersity Drive<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Burnaby, B.C. V5A 1S6<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nb=
sp; Canada<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Tel. +1 778-782-4237<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp;=
 Fax. +1 778-782-4947<br>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~=
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ <br>&gt; <br>&gt; <br>&gt; <br>&gt; =5F=5F=5F=
=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F LON-CAPA-users ma=
iling<br>&gt; list LON-CAPA-users@mail.lon-capa.org<br>&gt; <a href=3D"http=
org/mailman/listinfo/lon-capa-users</a><br><br>-- <br>Dr. Todd Ruskell<br>S=
enior Lecturer, Department of Physics &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Office: &nbsp;Me=
yer Hall 326<br>Colorado School of Mines &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;=
 &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Phone: 303-384-2080<br>1523 Illinois St=
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